https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31261533 4 years ago 413 comments
They have a certain beauty in their intricate details working together for function. I do really like looking at the glass back which shows some details and you can see the piece that move to gain power.
Although it seems youd have to pay a lot to get an accurate one because I have a $250 mechanical Seiko and its time keeping is junk. It was mediocre when I got it and has gotten worse. It was $150 when I bought it so I suppose it would have been a good investment if it hadn't got beat up.
Even rolex needs time setting, servicing to lube and clean metal parts, etc.
Gshock on the other hand will work for 10-15 years without a single manual time adjustment or battery swap needed.
Absolute unit.
This gold metal square one I especially love for summer:
https://www.casio.com/content/dam/casio/product-info/locales...
Now that is an unreliable watch! It'll usually lose maybe a minute a day which is actually pretty decent for something from when Khrushchev was in power, but it likes to randomly stop or occasionally start running fast or slow according to its mood. I'm not sure how much of it is because it's a Soviet frankenwatch and how much is that it's hard to find people who'll work on Soviet watches in the UK.
Why do you put up with that?
If your Seiko is really drifting by minutes per day, something's badly wrong with it and you should get it serviced.
You know you need to service mechanical watches regularly, right?
A 7S26 movement (Seiko's mass-produced budget workhorse) isn't that accurate (I think -35 to +45s per day IIRC?). But if you paid $250 secondhand you most likely have a 6R15 or similar inside, which should keep between -15s to +25s per day at worst if regularly serviced. Often you can get much better performance from these movements than the specs imply.
But ... you need to service that poor thing. For a 6R15, every 5 years at minimum, but as an old watchmaker I knew used to say -- a watch will tell you if it needs servicing earlier. Sounds like yours has been trying to get your attention for some time :)
(Otherwise, it's like complaining that the Porsche you haven't taken to a mechanic in the last decade doesn't drive so well any more ...)
You will never get quartz accuracy from any mechanical watch, but that's hardly the point.
(The ETA 2824-2 movement in the page you linked to -- the movement that powers most mid-range mechanical watches -- is substantially more accurate than these lower-range Seiko movements, although it's more costly as well.)
Mostly, yeah, but I have some nicer pieces that have been in my rotation for decades with only the barest minimum of services. Like, I think my Omega (ca. 1998) has been serviced maybe once, and it keeps great time.
No, most high end male jewelry are mechanical watches (and much of women-oriented jewelry as well).
High end watches are such a solved problem we don't even talk about them anymore. Either the G-shock, the Garmin watches, or the Apple Watch run circles around mechanical watches in terms of functionality with each satisfying a different niche (100% self-contained, long lived smart functionality, glance-oriented integration with full-stack personal tech ecosystem).
Personally I'm not interested in owning a luxury watch, I like the Garmin ones.
... and for reasons of money laundering and tax evasion, similar to artwork but even better suited. No customs official anywhere will flag and interrogate you about the watch on your wrist, the younger ones probably won't even know if you're having a watch worth six figures on your wrist or some cheap knockoff.
The price of the most expensive Garmin a quick internet search gave me is $3,100; the most expensive G-SHOCK €8,800 ⇒ IMHO, G-SHOCK definitely is a luxury brand.
Apple Watches, relative to those, are cheap at €999 max.
They're more like VW. A range of products low to high, but more expensive than domestics.
Luxury cars, luxury products are typically hand made, extremely niche. Apple is certainly not niche market.
Truly high-end luxury watches are priced in many multiples of 100,000 $ and are all mechanical.
I will never be able to afford any of them.
For example, this (pre-owned, good condition):
https://www.chrono24.com/patekphilippe/platinum-perpetual-ca...
Maybe it should be viewed like the sign of a healthy ecosystem; if it can support "exotic birds" like these, it's stable and healthy.
Just seems like the ideal way to spend the last period of your life; quietly making the small mechanical pieces and hopefully finally assembling something to be left behind.
Though I don't imagine I'd ever be able to produce something as small, accurate or intricate as these students are able to.
The main barrier to entry is that you need a lot of tools and supplies, I priced it out and to do a full service on an automatic I probably need $1000+ of tools and supplies.
We might call that a moral or poetic victory - but practically speaking, it's like an endangered human language which "still has over 100 native speakers". The future ain't looking good.
He was a true master of his craft and built a successful business based on his exceptional skill. He Was well known for his craftsmanship and his remarkable ability to repair virtually any watch or clock, no matter how complex.
Jewelers from across the city would bring him pieces that no one else could repair. For antique and vintage timepieces, he would often fabricate tiny replacement parts by hand when originals were no longer available. When he retired, very large companies would still come to his home to repair incredibly expensive pieces. He liked to tinker and would quietly work in his little home shop, pipe burning, radio playing, and visitors coming throughout the day to have him fix things.
When he passed, he had 10's of 1000's of watch parts in all these little bags that were all tagged and in boxes. We ended up giving them away to one of his customers who own several Jewelry stores. Had I known I would have offered them to this school along with 100's of watches he kept for parts.
[1] This model! https://www.fratellowatches.com/citizen-homer-second-setting...
It’s not likely to employ millions of people, but there will be demand from people with serious money. For instrument making, research labs will need specialized glass parts, for example; for painting maintenance, museums have a need to keep their centuries-old pieces in the best condition. For watches, if you pay a few million for a watch, paying 10k a year for maintenance should not be a problem. For that money, you can make a decent living of 20 customers a year in many countries.
As someone in love with fountain pens and ink, I can tell you that there are absolutely wealthy pen turners, private designers, and the same with watches.
I don't have the socials, so I don't see things like what you mentioned.
Watchmaking can take a heavy toll on eyesight, due to working with magnifying glasses on tiny parts during decades. Also each brand has unique processes and machinery, for which they have expensive learning courses.
Thus they would rarely consider applicants past their forties even if they have experience and favorable relations.
probably would make more $ from it if you were a YouTuber or TikTok creator and did "watchmaking" content.
Anecdotally, I see enough mechanical watches on wrists and in duty-free shops that I imagine there's enough of a pipeline there for at least one school. Much like vinyl records it doesn't appear to actually be going away even if it's superfluous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH3MtWln2Og
(ages ago, I was in touch with a person who described himself as "the last hand engraver in New York City" when considering an apprenticeship --- couldn't commit to the move --- always wondered if he found a successor)
Many modern watch parts are CNC machined, often the finishing is done by hand such as zaratsu polishing - but even that is a repetitive motion that can be mechanised.
I would not be surprised if given enough time even what we have today - a decent VLA model + some other specialised models, 6-axis CNC machine, an SMD pick and place etc would be capable of designing, manufacturing and assembling a mechanical watch.
But bespoke, handmade, high value, low volume stuff is still around.
After I got laid off in the US, I moved to a mountain town in New Zealand planning on being a ski lift operator while I think about the future, but got a software developer job by accident instead.
its almost the exact dilemma in Western Europe except the only saving grace is military security is guaranteed by its larger and richer neighbor
No, it isn't. Not true in absolute terms, not true per capita, not true adjusted for purchasing power.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ... section "U.S. states by GDP per capita if they were sovereign states"
From your link per capita GDP for Mississippi $55,877 in 2025 compared with $60,305 in 2026 for Canada [1]. That seems pretty similar.
My point was that when the Canadian dollar is weak GDP in USD decreases while when it’s strong GDP increases without anything about the country’s output changing - that’s the challenging of comparing by normalizing against a single currency.
I’ll let you do your own purchasing power math but Mississippi has significantly cheaper prices as part of America than Canada. Canada has a stronger safety net but that isn’t about purchasing power to much other than health insurance being baked into your taxes.
Mississippi has great weather year round. Canada gets really cold (most of those I know in Canada live in Manitoba). Your standard of living without electric is higher in Mississippi than in Canada in winter. If you are the typical person in Mississippi with electric service you have a nice life. Sure it is a little better elsewhere but not by much. You likely have more toys than someone in Europe.
This is downtown Jackson, it looks to be in far better shape than many Canadian cities: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQkKjiYu-qU
Canada's nominal GDP per capita is roughly $53,800 USD, which places it nearly on par with Mississippi
also Canada admits people from third world countries at a per-capita rate roughly four times higher than the United States, with none of the enforcement agencies capable of tackling illegal immigration which a lot of this demographic engages in. It's difficult for ICE now imagine Canada which has no such enforcement on the same scale
my point is that Canada has a smaller economy but imports more from the third world than its much richer and powerful neighbor.
this is not a sustainable arrangement.
A massive federal agency rounding up illegal immigrants actually isn't that effective, as has been seen in the USA. What actually works is making it impossible to find a job or housing without proof of citizenship - which is being done in Canada BTW
if illegal presence has almost no chance of interior enforcement, then overstaying or working illegally becomes a rational bet. If arrests, detention, removals, and employer raids become credible again, behavior changes that's the whole point of ICE raids they know they can't deport millions of people but to change the behavior of the demographic that they are targeting. This is something that Canada neither has the political capital to pursue.
No, Canada is not as poor as Missisipy.
https://www.visualcapitalist.com/how-canada-would-rank-as-th...
In a very real sense I have replaced use of the skills of watchmakers with AI.
Sorry about that. To be fair most watchmakers were already put out of work by quartz oscillators and integrated circuits in the 1980s.
But an AI provider absolutely got some of the money I might otherwise have spent on a clockwork watch.
Reason is very simple - they dont own clocks with hands when theh are kids.
(I'm generalizing / being a cranky old man and I'm not even that old)
Sure it takes longer to get proficient, but learning it is quicker than learning e.g. Roman numerals or how to tie a necktie.
What. Can you cite this research?
I've watched many watch repair videos online and the knowledge base required is huge. Also there are many tools needed which are not cheap. There is just so much to know that takes years to learn. Very cool that the knowledge is being shared and the skill passed on. In my small town there was only one guy who worked on clocks and watches. He passed a while back and his kids continue with his jewelry store but they now send out watches and clocks to another business as none of his kids learned how to do it.
1. https://www.ville.quebec.qc.ca/en/apropos/portrait/attraits/...
They are doing incredible things with world models, and have an economy that really could do incredible things with robots wired to effective world models.
It won't surprise me at all if in 10 years LLMs are less of a big deal than world models
